Car Control

[ahanson]

Hey all. Driving in the snow today here in central Vermont made me wonder how it is that people learn car control. I drove the Winter Challenge Rally last year, which exposed me to the limits of my car control skills. It was humbling. How did all of you start out learning car control as you approach the limits? Were you exposed to motorsport at an early age? Did you take a class or go to a clinic or find a mentor, or did you learn on your own on the back roads?

[Crazyswede]

Growing up in Vermont and living on dirt roads you just learn how to get up hills and stay on the road. Competing in Rally and Rally X also helps teach what works and what doesn't. I've done a few race track days as well and then I just play a lot and when I get a new to me car I go out on an empty road or find a parking lot and try different things to see how it will react. For instance my 9-5 would rather understeer through a corner and the rear end so rarely steps out and its proven to be a very stable and predictable platform. My 1998 NG900 was a totally different feel and it was a real knife edge between hanging out the rear on a corner and going for a loop. The older 900's and 99's are also nice and predictable and tend to understeer rather than spin. Been driving for about 27 years.

[DrewP]

Karting school, read a few driving instruction books, and playing around in big empty parking lots in the snow mostly. Every time I get a chance at an auto or rallycross to get an instructor to ride along I take the opportunity and try to pay attention to what they have to say, although I definitely have a few very stubborn bad habits.

[ahanson]

Both of these responses are in line with my thinking. I tend to experiment on my own, both on snow and on gravel. I like the idea of taking a course, but I'm still new enough to rally that I'm not sure it would be worth it yet. I still have specific skills I feel I ought to learn. Left-foot braking, for example. Drew, if you can recall the titles of the books you looked at, I'd be interested in tracking them down. Many thanks.

[DrewP]

All 5 ofCarroll Smith's "To Win" series are excellent, although there's only driving info in "Prepare," "Tune," "Drive," and some in "Engineer." These are easy to read, and entertaining if you're the somewhat sarcastic type. There's also The Technique of Motor Racing that I remember being pretty good but is a little more expensive. If I still have a copy you're welcome to borrow it for the cost of shipping. I lent my Carroll Smith books to a friend years ago and don't think I'll see them again, or I'd offer you those too.

Our local Rallycross chapter hosts a one day school twice a year, maybe there's something like that near you that isn't a full blown rally school to get your feet wet?

[Crazyswede]

If your goal is to start driving competitively in full rally (closed road, high speed, notes etc) then I think spending some money at a place like Team Oneal is worth every dollar. They can help you learn good habits before you have time to develop bad ones.

[ahanson]

Thanks, Drew, for the reading recommendations. I'll try to find the books, but if I can't track them down, I'll get back in touch.
I'm not sure what my goal is except to feel more comfortable pushing a car a little bit. I don't think I'll ever get deeper into rallying than the TSD stuff I'm starting to get into, but even that requires some practice. Team O'Neill sounds like a lot of fun, and if I stumble into a few hundred bucks, I would do a clinic up there in a heartbeat. The SCDA does some interesting car control clinics at Lime Rock, too. The average speeds on the Winter Challenge Rally last year topped out at 48 mph, which is pretty quick on a snowy back road. And as all Vermont residents know, sometimes it's fun to go the "state speed limit" on the dirt roads. Thanks again.

[Crazyswede]

There are a lot of car clubs out there that rent tracks out for the weekend and allow members and non members to come play. Often there will be a day or two of racing and a day for time trials. The time trial days are for race cars and street legal cars that are pass tech and its a great way to go out on a track and learn car handling (non winter of course). The BMW club in NH also does some ice racing on the lakes there and its for road cars its more of a time trial than door to door bump and grind racing.

Geoff and I did the Vermont Winter Challenge for about 8? years starting from its inception. We always used 900's and aside from a good set of snow tires we usually didnt have any special equipment. We used to compete in the class where you put tape over the Odometer and had to do everything by time. My recollection is there were always 2 events lumped together in the night and we pretty much always won our class in one of them and usually placed quite well overall.