Green Llama, 85 turbo T5 conversion

[johnshan]

Last day of spring break. I had hoped to get the T5 conversion done, but rainy weather and the fact that I still haven't received my wiring harness from eEuroparts made that goal an impossibility. I should be getting the harness monday, so maybe I can find some time next week to re-install all the intake tubing, button up the vacuum lines, and install the harness.

Status Report:
-Installed redtop injectors into c900 rail with 3.0 bar reg from 2.1 NA
-DI installed/distributor removed
-2.1 NA throttle body installed
-Air lines routed for T5 AIC... (not sure if Modern AIC necessary with Eeuro harness?)but I'm ready just in case
-New BPV, which will act as an atmospheric BOV
-intake air temp sensor mounted in intercooler pipe
-coolant temp sensor mounted
-Jordan:T5 lightened Flywheel mounted
-CPS mounted, air gap at 0.864 mm, (probably will re-adjust to 2mm if that is still advised?)
-New 7 piece clutch kit and slave cylinder, I will never do another c900 clutch without the proper tools haha
-old Harness removed
-Manual boost controller, I know its not the best option, but i figure it gives me the flexibility to run my car off base boost without a speed sensor. I want to get T5 suite going and the ability to read and write ECU's, I guess i figure I can go without some functionality until I have total control over the ECU.
-I'm also using a wide band 02 with an artificial narrow band signal, I hear CEL issues, but i feel like that doesn't really matter in my case.
-Still contemplating a creative solution for my lack of vacuum ports... any ideas? , I'm thinking of making a vacuum port header.

Im a little nervous to see how the stock 1998 900 turbo ECU runs.
More pictures to come once I get it all done.

Here are some before pictures

the rats nest

Some new stuff

as you can see I don't have many vacuum ports

a little fuzzy, but shinny new slave cylinder, clutch, flywheel, and CPS sensor.

just to show off the craftsmanship, Genius!

freshly surfaced

[Jordan]

Status Report:
-Air lines routed for T5 AIC... (not sure if Modern AIC necessary with Eeuro harness?)but I'm ready just in case
-Jordan:T5 lightened Flywheel mounted
-CPS mounted, air gap at 0.864 mm, (probably will re-adjust to 2mm if that is still advised?)
-New 7 piece clutch kit and slave cylinder, I will never do another c900 clutch without the proper tools haha
-old Harness removed
-Manual boost controller, I know its not the best option, but i figure it gives me the flexibility to run my car off base boost without a speed sensor. I want to get T5 suite going and the ability to read and write ECU's, I guess i figure I can go without some functionality until I have total control over the ECU.
-I'm also using a wide band 02 with an artificial narrow band signal, I hear CEL issues, but i feel like that doesn't really matter in my case.
-Still contemplating a creative solution for my lack of vacuum ports... any ideas? , I'm thinking of making a vacuum port header.

Im a little nervous to see how the stock 1998 900 turbo ECU runs.
More pictures to come once I get it all done.

You can use either any 89+ 900 AIC or the T5 AIC if you already have the hoses, the connectors should be the same, the 900 one fits better
Air gap should be 2mm
You just need one additional vacuum port, so a simple T off the the manifold works great. You just want as clean a signal as possible.
98 ECU should run ok, it will lean out at atmospheric and you'll have lots of CE codes, I'd suggest you don't run the MBC until you get a handle on T5Suite and sort out the other issues.

[johnshan]

Progress

[johnshan]

Lots of progress on the Llama,
Everything from the eEuroparts T5 conversion has been installed and I really appreciated Jordan for making sure everything was correct for my car. But, i haven't been able to get her running yet.

I think i'm not getting CPS signal.
so far, i have checked and re-checked timing ( really glad eEuro flywheel had TDC mark). I have tried CPS air gaps of 2, 1.5, and 1 mm. I can hear the fuel pump cycle when the ignition is turned on. CPS resistance at terminal 1 and 2 is 519 ohms, so i assume it's good. all sensors are brand new. injectors and AIC came off of supposedly good running car before it was crashed. exhaust doesn't smell like unburned fuel. seems as though I'm not getting fuel or spark. I have tach signal hooked up ( I think) but tach is completely un responsive to starting attempts ( ignition amplifier unplugged).

what gives? is there a way to check CPS signal with a multimeter? can I check fuel injectors with a test light without messing something up?

possible issues
-Wide band 02 with artificial narrow band signal( should start without any 02 signal right?)
-I haven't sourced a BCV yet so i have my MBC temporarily in place
-intake piping recently re-installed so massive air leak is a possibility
- CPS is tricky to get perfectly true with flywheel face.
- fresh tune on T5 ECU with T7 BCV mod ( many thanks to Jordan)
- ignition coil still in place due to laziness

I want to get my car running! ideas?

[Jordan]

Leave it at 2mm. Do you have another ecu to swap in? On rare occasion I've had an ecu not take a program.

Does that tach needle move while cranking?

[johnshan]

I don't have another ECU, but I was planning on picking one up if I make it to the junk yard next week to buy a BCV and turn signal switch. Would my fuel pump turn on if the ECU didn't flash properly?

tach needle doesn't move when cranking, tach signal wire from from ECU is blue? I tried both blue and white, neither moved the needle while cranking. I tapped into the wire coming off of the main fuse/relay plug 152b wire 14.

[Jordan]

Yup sounds right. Yes ecu could prime pump with no start. I could send you a known good if it will help you troubleshoot.

[johnshan]

That would be awesome. The chances of me getting out to the junkyard next week is slim. Seems highly possible that it's the ECU, and at very least removes a big variable.

[squaab99t]

I don't have another ECU, but I was planning on picking one up if I make it to the junk yard next week to buy a BCV and turn signal switch. Would my fuel pump turn on if the ECU didn't flash properly?

tach needle doesn't move when cranking, tach signal wire from from ECU is blue? I tried both blue and white, neither moved the needle while cranking. I tapped into the wire coming off of the main fuse/relay plug 152b wire 14.

Have you pulled each spark plug yet? If they are soaked or dry as a bone that can point you in the right direction. I have a friend who has known good injectors, but they sat unused for over two years. They were stuck shut and all the ecu input in the world would not open them for their injector pulse. Thus no fuel no fire....

[johnshan]

I pulled the spark plug at the number one piston and it was completely dry. ill probably go ahead and check the others after I give starting a try again.

side story-
Injectors are from a 98 900 that was high centered, sprung an oil leak, and then was carelessly driven until the engine ran out of oil and self destructed. shame shame. I don't think the injectors have been out of commission for too long, but ill seriously keep it in mind, they are basically the only thing thats not brand new.

[squaab99t]

I pulled the spark plug at the number one piston and it was completely dry. ill probably go ahead and check the others after I give starting a try again.

side story-
Injectors are from a 98 900 that was high centered, sprung an oil leak, and then was carelessly driven until the engine ran out of oil and self destructed. shame shame. I don't think the injectors have been out of commission for too long, but ill seriously keep it in mind, they are basically the only thing thats not brand new.

You can have them cleaned and flow tested. Always a good idea on used injectors anyways.
Another thing T5 needs is a minimum voltage at the ecu while cranking. 9.7 volts seems to ring a bell? Get your battery all charged up before you try trouble shooting and cranking again. A volt meter can confirm while you are cranking.
FYI turn only one "knob" at a time while trouble shooting that way you can systematically go thru each part if the system and not just shooting from the hip. My .02

[johnshan]

oh really, minimum voltage... hmm interesting. I put my battery on a trickle charger because it was completely dead, but probably only charged it half way before cranking. I'll check voltage on my next attempt.

[Jordan]

I think it is a CPS or ECU problem. I know Gary Reider had an issue with a brand new bosch CPS, which is also very rare, but always possible. You might need to move the CPS out ever farther as well, I haven't tested the full range of the flywheel setup , but i know I always have trouble less than 2mm. I should really do that. Maybe Gary can tell us what measurement he ended up at? Perfect flat facing alignment is really not that important, in fact it probably helps the signal a little to show some ramp up. Also make sure you have the CPS and MAP connectors not swapped. CPS is silver, black , black and the MAP, is grey , black , blue.

ECU is definitely a possibility. Soldering and picking pins out of them for the T7 valves can sometimes cause issues as well as the flash chips not really wanting to be reflashed.

I will send one out from my car today that I know works and is set up for the T7 valve. It will at least help with the trouble shooting.

[gmreider]

I ended up making a shim pack out of brass that is about .090 " thick or a hair over 2 MM as Jordan says. I just lift the flywheel cover a bit and slid in it between the back of the flywheel and the crank sensor nose and apply a light pressure to the sensor holder and snug up the 2 Allen head adjustment bolts.

Jordan, you could probably make up a spacer like that and include with the kit. Might eliminate some confusion?
Anyway the car is working fine with that setting and I have been running it up to 6,000 RPM and over with no missing. starts after a few revolutions almost every time.

[Jordan]

That is a good idea Gary, I thought about that, but then was quickly distracted by something else :)... I'd probably just get some shim stock and cut up sections to send along with the kits.