Introduction & Project thread! 1989 900 T8 Special DD

[reiernumans]

What's up? New here, figured I'd introduce myself by starting a thread about my beloved c900. I'm Reier, I'm from the Netherlands and bought this example when my old workplace got it as a trade-in. It's been my daily driver for the past two years (and well over 50.000km), so far I've been loving every minute of it! I'll go in to detail about the car and my plans further in this thread. For now; picture time!

How it was when I bought it;



Most recent pic;

[Geoff]

Neat, I didn't know anything about the '89 T8 Special model until now. Thanks for sharing!
http://saabisti.fi/saab-900-t8-special-1989/#.XVbkDPJKipo

In the US we didn't get any of the Ox Blood dashboards except for on a few 1984 SPG/AERO prototype cars

[reiernumans]

The T8 Special was a special edition for the Swedish market, only built for the 1989 model year. Basically a fully loaded SPG/Aero/T16s, just with the 8v turbo engine. I think it was put together to help get rid of the last 8v cars.

My car originally started life with the B201 Turbo engine in it, but according to the old Swedish papers I have with the car was converted to a 16v Turbo engine in the summer of 1989. It spent it's entire life (until it went to the Netherlands) in and around Trollhättan, and the conversion appears to be to full MY89 factory specs, including pretty much every factory option (AC, cruise control, drivers seat heater with a button instead of automatic). I dug into it a little, and I have the feeling this car used to belong to a factory employee who built this for himself. I have reached out to the Museum in Trollhattan to find out if they know anything about older test cars (either by VIN or license plate), but haven't gotten anything worthwhile out of them yet.

The goal for this car is to be a modern, sporty, driving car with the classic c900 look I fell in love with. It's got good bones, with barely any rust, a sunroof, pretty much all options and the best color combination ever. So far I haven't gone too wild with it yet. Just making sure everything is ready and up to snuff for the eventual bump in power and torque.

As it sits now, I've been through the top end of the engine (B212 head and intake, B204 cams, modded cam sprockets), deleted the cat (which helped with spool and a little peak power) and toyed with the APC system a little. It pulls well enough to make the brand new 215mm clutch kit slip at full boost. I've also toyed around with suspension setups. I got my hands on a used spring, damper and sway bar kit built by a Dutch tuner, but after driving on that for a year decided I didn't like the match between the shocks and the springs at all and sold the complete kit. I'm now running Abbott Racing springs, GAZ (rebound) adjustable shock absorbers and the factory ARBs with poly bushings on them. The car feels much more controlled now, although it's a little low for my taste, so I might go for a round three of suspension work to get it dialed in perfectly. I've also been through the entire stereo setup. Running Hertz speakers in all four factory locations, an underseat sub mounted to the side of the trunk and a Kenwood DAB+ radio head unit in the dash. It's been pretty good, but can be optimized a little more. I feel like it could use a little punchier mids and the sub wants to resonate a little when I turn it up so it needs a little sound deadening work.

The most recent update I did to the car was a custom big brake kit, the exact same kit Jesper Schwartz is running on his RWD 99, just redrilled to 4x108. Loving it so far. I'll post some pictures of the suspension and brakes below.


Future plans are the following;
- full do88 catalogue, maybe I'll skip the rad, but I want the hose kits and the FMIC badly;
- ATP Ultimate Wastegate, 3" downpipe, 100/200 cell cat to probably a custom 2.5" stainless exhaust to keep the sound mellow. Maybe I'll spring for a Varex (style) muffler to be able to make noise when I want. It's pretty loud as it sits and I'd kinda like to fly under the radar a little more, especially since it's a daily driver;
- Trionic 7 conversion, I have a friend who tunes Trionic professionally and has a deep love for how nicely he can get T7 cars running. The conversion into a c900 has been done before, I've seen that car in person and heard it running. I think it'll be a cool project and knowing Dion he'll be able to get it running very nicely;
- taller gears; I think after I get to adding power and torque I'd like to move to a Jörgen Eriksson 8.5 primary gear set to get the revs down at highway speeds. It needs more low end grunt before I do that though.
- Height adjustable suspension. As I mentioned above, I love how the car feels now. I just think it's a tad low for ideal daily driver use. I've been looking at what some Swedes have done suspension wise and I'd like to follow a similar path in getting everything perfectly adjusted height/comfort wise in the future;
- Rear brake upgrade, mostly a visual thing. My fronts are 320mm rotors with Brembo four-piston calipers now, the rears are the factory 258mm solid rotors. I found a 300mm rotor that should work nicely with the possibility of retaining the factory (e-brake) caliper, I just have to buy the rotors, have them redrilled and make up some kind of caliper adapter bracket ideally;
- Sound insulation/de-rattling. I have some rattles in the car that annoy me to no end on longer drives. I'm gonna have to find the time to replace the sunroof cassette, put some sound-deadening on the roof skin before putting the liner back in. I want to do the same to the doors and behind the rear seat panels. Ideally the trunk floor and sides as well. I think that'd really help improve the modern feel of the car, even though sound insulation is already MUCH improved over my old '81 900;
- Stereo upgrade. It works pretty good as it is now, with four new speakers, a modern radio and a small active sub in the back. I just feel like I miss a little midbass, so ideally I'd like to build a set of speaker pods to fit into the bottom of the door panels. On the list of future projects.


With all the work I do I plan on taking my time to do it right, instead of doing it in the cheapest or quickest way. The end result should be a pretty good representation of everything I'd want out of a fun daily driver, whilst retaining the style and classic looks of the c900. I'm not interested in peak power or having the lowest/coolest car. I want a smooth feeling power delivery, sporty (but not super harsh) suspension and nice stereo so I can enjoy every drive I take. I'm fairly sure it's gonna take a while (especially since some of the plans I have get pricy very quickly), but I have no intentions of selling this car anytime in the forseable future, so it'll be a fun road to get there.


After such a long story, it's probably time for some pics, huh?

Suspension V2.0 fully laid out on the garage floor before getting it onto the car;


Suspension V2.0 in the rear;


Suspension V2.0 in the front;


Fredrik Olsson front BBK mounted (Audi 320mm rotors redrilled and grooved, Alfa 159/Brera Brembo calipers, EBC Redstuff pads, 9000 caliper conversion lines);


And, my favorite part about the big brakes, they're super sneaky;

[squaab99t]

Very nice list of current and future mods. Glad to see you putting the time and money into doing it right.

[Krizzie]

Welcome Reier!

I drove your 900 and it handles very well, just get those nasty rattles out and it's perfect in my opinion. :D

[aero84]

Looking very nice
How are you liking the GAZ dampers?

[reiernumans]

So far I really enjoy them! Although it sometimes feels like the valving could be a little better for stiffer springs. I wonder if GAZ would do custom stuff for that if you contacted them. I just ordered 'regular' adjustables through their webshop.

Fixed the most annoying door rattle EVER last thursday, fresh oil + filter and spark plugs, looked everything over (it really needs new crank seals..) and left for a long weekend in France on friday. About halfway there (450km into the drive) I entered a traffic jam, and when I pressed the clutch I noticed the car was running on three cylinders. Rolled to the first gas station and tried to figure out what the hell happened, but couldn't find anything odd so I called AAA. They're conclusion is there's too much oil getting into cylinder number three, so either piston rings or valve stem seals. Both don't really make sense to me given the stoutness of these bottom ends and the fact that the valve stem seals are pretty fresh (and the car gets new OE oil filter and Castrol oil every 10k km's, I keep track of the oil level/pressure, temps weren't odd, etc). No visible contamination in the oil or coolant, no high pressure in the cooling system from exhaust gasses.. I'm still convinced it's something ignition, the cap is pretty burnt up, the plug wires are still the 30yo OE ones.. I guess I'll start my own diagnose when it gets back here..



PS. It still looks pretty good, even on a flat bed...

[reiernumans]

Car has since been dropped off at a local shop (since AAA wouldn't take it to a home address). When I got the call from the shop that the car had been delivered they also mentioned the transporter had managed to break the ignition switch. Car goes into every gear but the key won't turn anymore.. I suspect he forced it out of reverse without a key in it or something, but we'll see once I pick it up at the shop..

When it rains it storms I guess..

[reiernumans]

Small update; I've got the car sitting at home now, still working through the damage claim with the transporter. The ignition switch only turns between lock and P, I can put it in every gear with no issue and it doesn't lock in reverse anymore. Not sure how they did it, but they managed to break it..

They also managed to bend pretty much the entire exhaust system. Downpipe sits firmly on the Kurbads rally skidplate, testpipe flange touches the tunnel, the clamp before the muffler almost touches, the muffler is about 2-3 inches forward of where it's supposed to sit, stretching the hangers and pushing it into the heatshield and the tailpipe is firm against the fueltank. I had it up on a lift to assess the damage (full replacement necessary) and take some pics, then trailered it home to work the damage claim out with the transporter and start diagnosing what the hell happened to the engine.

I looked into the cilinders with an endoscope, and noticed numbers 3 and 4 look like they're wet (car hasn't run in at least two weeks). Numbers 1 and 2 are fine. The car did burn a little oil before I left on the trip, but nothing crazy and I attributed most of the oil loss to weeping crank seals (both the large and the small one + oil pump o-ring are 30 years old by now). I got a little smoke from the exhaust every now and then but couldn't really reproduce it when I tried. Now it only runs on three cilinders and the plugs in 3 and 4 are oily..

I'm a bit stumped at the moment. I still have to do the basics (compression and leakdown tests) for diagnosing, but I'm mentally preparing for a rebuild. Realistically it can only be either the valve stem seals or the piston rings, but I've never heard of a cilinder not firing due to oil from the valve stem seals, and I haven't seen a B202 with destroyed rings before with how tough they are..

If anybody here has ever experienced something similar or has any idea what the hell could be going on or what I need to test before ripping stuff apart I'm open to suggestions. I think it might be a while before I get it on the road again..

[Jordan]

I would first determine which cylinder and what aspect of combustion it is having problems with. Compression, fuel or spark. That should narrow down the direction of further investigation. Report back with your findings...

[reiernumans]

I did measure for resistance through the plug wires, forgot to mention that in the post above.

1. 3500 Ohm
2. 2800 Ohm
3. 2460 Ohm
4. 1800 Ohm

I also tested if the spark plug and cable were okay on the side of the road by starting it with the plug out but attached to the cable, I definately saw it sparking. I tried figuring out which cilinder wasn't playing along by disconnecting the injectors one by one. Disconnecting number 3 didn't affect how the car ran, which lead me to believe that's the most problematic one (that isn't firing). Battery is on a charger now and hopefully I'll find the time to do some quick tests soon!

[Geoff]

I had a B202 once where the #3 valve burned out. It ran on 3 cylinders. I seem to remember the plug being wet due to lack of compression/firing...

[DrewP]

Check the compression. I had one that cracked a piston enough to lose compression but it stayed together and didn't score up the block. If it's the piston you'll have puffs of oily smoke coming up out of the dipstick tube with the engine idling since it's blowing cylinder pressure down into the crankcase. If you are lucky it's just a valve like Geoff said since then all you have to do is the head gasket and not pull the whole engine out.

It's also possible it's just the head gasket!

[reiernumans]

It's been a while, but I figured it's about time for an update here..

I got the car running again a couple of weeks ago. Still have some work to do to get it through inspection to be able to drive it on the road as well, but at least it runs! First thing we did after getting the car in the shop was fixing the ignition lock. As it turns out, the transporters managed to break the big steel hook that locks the shifter in reverse. I have no clue how they did it, as I think even if you karate-kick the shifter from the backseat you'll break the shifter before you'll break the hook, but hey. Replaced it with a piece from a used housing and we were back in action.

After fixing the ignition lock, we turned to the engine. Starting with a compression test. Cylinders 1, 2 and 4 were fine, with healthy numbers, but cyl 3 had an obvious issue, as the gauge wouldn't even move at all. We followed by doing a basic leakdown test, pressurizing each cylinder with air and listening for leaks. When we got to cylinder three it was immediately obvious there was a massive leak into the exhaust. No pressure would get into the intake or the PCV, so we decided to pull the head to see what happened. We were greated by this;



Burnt exhaust valve in no. 3

We decided to check the lifters on no. 3, since only a single valve was burned, and noticed the one that was on the burnt valve was stuck. Wouldn't budge in any way. Fuel pressure and injector spray patterns all look good, so I think that one lifter got stuck in a position where the valve couldn't fully close, causing it to burn up. They were used T7 lifters, so possibly some sludge remains in that one..

We decided that, instead of replacing the engine (for a used one in a parts car), we would replace the head, install brand new lifters and go from there.


I'll post a full update on everything we've done later.

[reiernumans]

After about 5000 miles I figured it's about time to put up the full update here. A lot has happened since my last post, so let's get into it!

When I was prepping to get the car back on the road again I planned on installing another used engine, as I expected my problems to come from the bottom end. To do that as 'properly' as one can in a weekend without doing the head, I decided to get a set of fresh crank seals and some other gaskets that typically leak oil. I also decided that installing another engine into the car would be the best time to take care of flywheel and clutch upgrades and a few other maintenance bits.

After changing the gameplan (from installing a different longblock to getting a rebuilt head on the bottom end that belongs to the car), we decided to go ahead and do all the maintenance bits to this bottom end (in car). Started by replacing the timing side crank seal and oil pump o-ring (which were both leaking oil), found a nice rusty track that lead to the water pump gasket (so that was my slow coolant leak all those miles.. Couldn't see anything because of the oil leak and the mess it left on the timing cover), so installed a new waterpump as well. After that we removed the clutch, slave cylinder and flywheel. Using the OEM tool made installing a new flywheel side crank seal easy work, and it was time to install the MCS flywheel I had bought. I paired this with a new OEM 220mm clutch disc and new Sachs Viggen pressure plate. Only after this we went ahead and installed the freshened up replacement head. New Febi Bilstein headbolts were used, as well as an Elring head gasket, OEM B2X5 part.no. exhaust manifold gasket (which seals a lot better than the cheap ones), Elring valve cover gaskets, new injector o-rings and a bunch of other little things. Getting everything back together felt like a HUGE job, but it fired right up and after adjusting ignition timing even idled pretty solid. Onto the next hurdle; passing the Dutch equivilent of MOT (and some other 'upgrades' and mods).






So, to pass MOT I knew of one definite issue, and suspected two other issues (that had been remarks in the past years). Number one was the front brake lines. Ever since upgrading to the front BBK the Goodridge lines I was running (a kit designed to work with 9000 front calipers on a c900) touched the inner barrel of the wheel at full lock and some droop. After looking at a couple of options, I decided to just get a set of HEL lines from Saabits for the 9000 caliper conversion, as they have a 90 bend on one of the fittings, which would allow me to point the line away from anything it might touch. I went a little OCD here and decided to get the full six piece kit for the car + get a braided clutch line. The rear Goodridge lines worked perfectly fine, but I feel better about it having a matching set vs mismatching brands. This plan worked exactly as I had hoped, so I was in the clear here! The other two potential problems were rust starting to form on the right hand driveshaft tunnel and right headlight beam pattern.





Sadly, the car ended up not passing due to both the rust and the headlight beam pattern. Time to start working again..

First; the headlights. I tried a set of China projectors, but wasn't really into the look and the HID kit that came with them kept flickering.


I decided to treat myself to a set of brand new headlight units. They're relatively affordable still and really freshen up the look, as you can see here;


After that was tackled, it was time to start on the rust. I knew a it was starting to form a little rust in the tunnel, but had NO idea how bad it had gotten until I got this pic;


Everything was cut out;


And new weld-in panels were used to get the pieces required to fix it back up;


MOT ready it is!

I've had the car on multiple lowering setups, but it looked visually too low for my taste on both setups, so I decided to go back to a more OEM suspension setup. I left the GAZ adjustable shocks in there, remounted the springs that came factory on the car (SPG setup) and got new reproduction rear SPG spec springs from Saabits, along with the airlift helper spring setup (Steve Lewis sells these).




And a little overview of the rear, showing how we ran the airline up through the e-brake cable grommet to under the back seat. It's just a car tire valve stem chilling there so I can pump it up whenever I carry a load.


Which resulted in the perfect OEM+ stance (in my opinion), much better driving dynamics, and it means the car is high enough that I can actually remount the SPG flares!



That pretty much brings us up to date here! I've done a couple little things here and there, like adjusting the wastegate actuator (and finding out I really should replace with a new one if I want it consistent), fitting a Saab S&R steering wheel and fitting Combi Coupé side vents vs the normal 900 ones with covers. Today the car will be going to the alignment shop, with a fresh set of stainless shims to get camber and caster set to where I want them, next steps will be modifying the wheels (they're 7.5J ET25, which is a little wide, the hub is thick enough to have them machined to ET30 which should be spot on) and taking care of some rattles and other little bugs before I make the step to Trionic.