Saab 99 Odd Instrument Issue (w/ CIS issues just for fun)

[MattWatson]

Hey All,

My 99 has started to have the typical crappy cold idle issue... no surprise really. I just usually leave the car to warm up so that temperature registers, then it runs flawlessly. However this morning, I didn't have time to wait, so I just drove it while it was running crappy (which I have done before with no issues, it just takes longer to heat up). I made it about 100m down the back alley and then the car just died while doing 30 or so.

In the alley, I pulled the king lead off the dist, had spark there but seemed weak, pullled a plug and had nothing at the plug (it was greasy though). I popped the dist cap and reseated to be sure, but that didn't make a difference.

Got it back into the garage, and I swapped the coil to one from the 900, and didn't seem to make any difference in the spark, so the coil was good. pulled all 4 plugs, which were soaked at this point (I had cranked it a lot in the back alley trying to get it started again and while checking spark). I pulled the fuel pump relay, then grabbed a spare plug and plugged it into one of the wires and then cranked. It had spark at the plug. I then took all 4 and torched em, cleaned them with a rag and stuck them back in.

I didn't try to fire it up yet, but instead left the relay out, and then took the bellows off the trottle body, sprayed in some carb cleaner then turned it over. It fired immediately and then I ran it till it died.

I then popped the relay back in, and then fired it up again, and it ran.. but absolutely terribly even though it was warm (I had plugged in the block heater to try to evaporate some of the gas in the cylinder). I left it running for 5 mins or so, and it didn't improve, so it is time to start looking for vacuum leaks and check the bellows for proper operation. I'm also going to check the distributor to make sure I didn't screw up anything... I never had the problem before.

Now to the part that actually pisses me off, and the real point of this post... At some point, during this, something happened to my dash cluster, and now none of the guages are working. Fuel level, temp and tach are not working. Also I have a oil pressure gauge in the center console that isn't registering either now. Dash lights work fine, and the battery light also works (didn't try e-brake, and signals have never worked). No fuses are blown that I can see, which I assume would effect the lights as well not just the instrument.

Are there any hidden fuses or anything that I should check? I find it odd that they all went at the same time unless they are linked at some point. I really would like to get them working before I run the car much more since I am worried I may have gotten gas into the oil and want to make sure my pressures are up.

Any ideas?

[SwedeSport]

What about the ignition module on the left front inner fender?

[MattWatson]

What about the ignition module on the left front inner fender?

What should I check with it? When I was doing the initial troubleshooting I pushed on the connector to ensure it was seated, but nothing more than that.

[Crazyswede]

Check to make sure the plug on the back of the instrument cluster hasn't come loose

[SwedeSport]

If you have another one from a car you know ran. throw it in the glovebox. They do go bad from time to time. I just keep a spare.

[gmreider]

I don't think 99's had hall effect ignition? They don't have an ignition module on the left front fender. If memory serves me right, they have a pretty big module on the right side that rarely gave problems. They also have two ballast resistors on the right side. Corrosion and poor connections could be your problem. Does yor car still have ceramic fuses in the fuse panel?
Tell us more and I'll get my 99 shop manual out tonight.

[Luke]

I don't think 99's had hall effect ignition? They don't have an ignition module on the left front fender. If memory serves me right, they have a pretty big module on the right side that rarely gave problems. They also have two ballast resistors on the right side. Corrosion and poor connections could be your problem. Does yor car still have ceramic fuses in the fuse panel?
Tell us more and I'll get my 99 shop manual out tonight.

Yeah the 99's and early 900's use the inductive type which is the ~4"x4" black box and the distributor has 4 metal prongs inside instead of the shutter wheel used on the later 900's. I've never seen or heard of one of those going bad.

[SalemSaab]

FWIW, I had the same problem last winter .. car would crank but not start when below freezing (starter fluid in the intake solved this); if it did start on its own it would want to die out unless I gave it some gas until warmer. I figured the "cold start injector / warm-up regulator" was faulty as everyone says is common.

I had the fuel injectors cleaned last Spring, and all Winter this year I have had no problem starting it, even with temps in the 20s. Today (20s) it did the want-to-die-out move, but a single blip of the accelerator got it back to high idle + no problems.

[MattWatson]

So went to start it again after work... and... everything is fine

Started up perfectly fine, idled fine, (then went a bit rough, but nothing terrible) Guages are working again????

So I wonder if something stuck open enough to flood the spark enough while driving that it just died? The only thing I really "fixed" was burning off the spark plugs. I wonder if the injectors stuck open yesterday morning.

Cold temps are relative in this case... It died at -7c yesterday. Today is -14c and no problems, and I have run it at -25c with absolutely no problem.

Once it is a bit warmer, I will pull the injectors to see what kind of pattern they are giving. I tried getting a vaccum leak, and there wasn't one that I could find (tested bellows, injectors, TB) which fits, because the car runs like a top after it is warm.

Guess I will just see

[SaabsBreakDown]

I always like to have the cold start injector on a switch so you can tell if its on the rich side or the lean side when CIS is doing weird stuff. It really helps you focus your efforts. Plus, a lot of times it just solves all the rough starting issues. Between that and having the fuel pump fuse right on the dash it's pretty easy to get the rally car going if it's being picky.

The other thing I find handy is having a 'favorite' warm up regulator handy.

[MattWatson]

At this point, I am almost 100% sure that everything is ground related. It has a couple wierd issues still... but I dd it just a couple km a day so it's not that big a deal.

I am also 100% sure the rough cold condition is because the warm up injector is not working. Its the same unplugged or plugged in.

It also has an issue where it goes through phases (which it's in now) of not activating the main relay. I havn't taken the time to figure out why yet. This ended up being the issue that I ran into with the tach not working... nothing is working except the radio (because the previous owner decided not to grab a switched source) headlights and door buzzer.

All in all, the wiring on this car is a disaster. I knew it when I bought it, and I like wiring. It'll all get replaced with parts of a harness from a '89 that a friend is parting out.