16v Springs & Valves

[Jordan]

So I've been thinking about some 16v N/A development and decided to raid the parts bins to see if I could get some info on some part interchanges.

First, I looked at valve springs. I had heard that the Volvo 8v springs were an upgrade. Dimensionally, they look the same except for fewer coils and thicker wire. I calculated the spring rate out as

SAAB Stock ~163 in/lb
Volvo 8v ~210in/lb

I was also thinking that you may not need to upgrade your springs if your valves were lighter. So I wanted to compare the c900, T5 and T7 intake valves (Left to Right)

I think that the T5 valves may be a good alternative due to the reliefs cut to reduce valve shrouding as well as being lighter weight. The T7 valves seem awfully spindly. They also look like they might(?) increase compression by a small margin. Plus, the upper section is the same so you could retain your keepers and I think the standard valve seals (the cheap ones) would work. I'd like to get them on a gram scale to weigh them as well.

[gmreider]

I have also been staring at the 3 valves as you have and I think the T-5 with the thinned down stem is the way to go. Also ,I think the valve is ever so slightly larger in head diameter?
I have to admit , Have you ever seen any spring breakage on 16V motors?

[gmreider]

Another question. The most destructive stuff I have seen was the breaking of timing chains while flying down the road. I saw a bunch of the them bending valves and smacking pistons years ago after they changed the upper head oiling system. I used to check the pistons for damage , but never really found any damage and later just replaced the heads. I have seen a few turbo's bust up the ring lands on pistons. I attributed that to detonation and excess boost and crap fuel.

[Jordan]

I've never seen springs break, but I think the valves start to float above ~7200rpm. The diameter might be slightly bigger (need to grab the calipers from the shop) but I think the seats are the same?

[Geoff]

Lighter lifter buckets would help with valve float too. With sustained high RPMs I'm not sure if hydraulic lifters would be the best choice (?) so it might be worthwhile to source lighter lifter buckets with valve shims...

[Jordan]

The new replacements buckets are lighter as well. I've heard of people welding the hydraulic function and running shims or lash caps.

[Freecirc]

I have heard that the T5 intake valves are the real difference for the 2.1L Head, but what about the Exhaust valves? Doesn't the 2.1L head and the T5 have the same looking valves for the exhaust or are they different like the intake side? IS there a part number for those volvo 8v valves, or a motor and year range to reference? Finally, has there been any research done regarding wear with stiffer valves, and I mean REAL research, not just, "it should be fine..." kind of research...

Because I think Jordans Ideas here are great, but I will be running with Hydraulic lifters and the head will be used in a turbocharged motor as a daily driver, so more power is desired, but wear and longevity are neccassary.

Peace,
Rob
~and~
Ash - 1989 SPG

[Crazyswede]

The head I have is a standard B202 head fitted with larger Volvo valves, lash caps, solid lifters and I think double valve springs. The solid lifters are just the stock 16v lifters with the hydraulic portion removed and the oil hole tig welded shut.

[squaab99t]

The head I have is a standard B202 head fitted with larger Volvo valves, lash caps, solid lifters and I think double valve springs. The solid lifters are just the stock 16v lifters with the hydraulic portion removed and the oil hole tig welded shut.

Do you have a picture of the hydraulic plunger removed and filled with what? I got the plugging the side hole, but not sure what that buys?

[Crazyswede]

The head I have is a standard B202 head fitted with larger Volvo valves, lash caps, solid lifters and I think double valve springs. The solid lifters are just the stock 16v lifters with the hydraulic portion removed and the oil hole tig welded shut.

Do you have a picture of the hydraulic plunger removed and filled with what? I got the plugging the side hole, but not sure what that buys?

I will look, I think we took some photos.

[squaab99t]

The head I have is a standard B202 head fitted with larger Volvo valves, lash caps, solid lifters and I think double valve springs. The solid lifters are just the stock 16v lifters with the hydraulic portion removed and the oil hole tig welded shut.

Do you have a picture of the hydraulic plunger removed and filled with what? I got the plugging the side hole, but not sure what that buys?

I will look, I think we took some photos.

Cool. I would like to know if a solid lifter is easily made with existing part.

[Jon1]

http://www.nysocphotos.com/Jon-Williams-Garage/Other-Saabs/Notchbacks/26486412_D2dzGZ#!i=2991886749&k=CtgGp4q

[Freecirc]

Anyone have this info, pretty please?
Is there a part number for those volvo 8v valves, or a motor and year range to reference? Finally, has there been any research done regarding wear with stiffer valves, and I mean REAL research, not just, "it should be fine..." kind of research...

peace,
Rob

[Jordan]

The volvo springs are 8v 2/7/940 springs (B230 engines). http://www.eeuroparts.com/Parts/7372/Va ... d-9135130/

You'd only really want them for high revving applications. The stock ones seem to do fine until 7000 rpm or so. Also if you use the T5 intake valves, I they are lighter and would not need as much spring to work them anyway.

[Crazyswede]

Anyone have this info, pretty please?
Is there a part number for those volvo 8v valves, or a motor and year range to reference? Finally, has there been any research done regarding wear with stiffer valves, and I mean REAL research, not just, "it should be fine..." kind of research...

peace,
Rob

I assume you mean stiffer valve springs and the impact that they have on the valve itself? I don't know of any studies to determine if there is an increase in valve stretching or necking or even impact on the valve seats themselves. However most of these parts are going into high revving racing engines that see relatively small amount of use...vs being used in a daily driving application.