"WRC style" shifter...

[stig-swoosh]

...I was curious about these shifters you see on some swedish competition Saabs...I know Demontweeks used to sell a similar design for universal application but it's no longer in their catalog,I'll try to scan a pic of it from an old catalog,it was probably made/distributed by TAS Autosport...
...anyway,I made a post on 900klubben inquiring about these & someone was kind enough to respond...sending me here:
http://www.team-engelbrektsson.com/
...scroll down to "säljes & tjänster" then scroll down to "växelspak rallycross" & that's the shifter...their picture of it ain't the greatest & I think "tillfälligt slut" means temporarily sold out (I'm not 100% sure though)...they're asking 1800SEK which is about $270 USD...

...here is a couple of interesting threads of people fabricating similar shifters :
http://www.mk1love.com/forums/showthread.php?t=792
and here :
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1800921

...one thing I'm curious about is the ethical question, I mean it takes much skill & labor-intensive time to fabricate some topnotch kit,like with the VW guys that Bildon shifter costs like $700 or something so being able to fabricate yourself is fully awesome...I guess in just about any case it's okay to "borrow" someone else's design if you have the ability to fabricate it yourself...I was just thinking back to how Saabsavior copied Jörgen's shifter & started selling them,sure you could say he was doing US Saab enthusiasts a service by having the shifters easily available at a lower cost (Jörgen's shifter was quite pricey)...but I think it probably pissed Jörgen off to see this happen,did it scare him off from being more friendly w/ U.S. Saab enthusiasts?...I dunno...any thoughts/opinions on this subject?

[stig-swoosh]

another photo :


"riktigt hardkore!"

[Luke]

Thats funny I've been working on several designs very similar to that for several months now. I have a couple drawing done and should have a prototype done within the next couple months. I want to get the shifter up as close to the steering wheel as possible.

[Hans]

For your own car? Fair game, IMO. There’s nothing unique or special about those shifters: they’re just fancy levers with unusual fulcrums compared to most, and you’re not profiting from copying the design if it’s for your own use. If you were to do a clean-sheet design, you’d probably come up with something similar: stiff metal box, lightened, shifter mechanism with desired throw, etc.

Now, if you were to disassemble, say, Jörgen’s shifter to reverse-engineer it measurement-for-measurement, fab’d some up, and sold them on the web, well, you’d be an ass, because, then, you’re ripping off someone else, profiting from it, and the person whose design you ripped off is on another continent, unable to come poke you in the eye for being said ass.

[SteveTheFolkie]

Now, if you were to disassemble, say, Jörgen’s shifter to reverse-engineer it measurement-for-measurement, fab’d some up, and sold them on the web, well, you’d be an ass, because, then, you’re ripping off someone else, profiting from it, and the person whose design you ripped off is on another continent, unable to come poke you in the eye for being said ass.

As I understand the law, if they held a patent for their design and we had normal diplomatic relations with their country they could, in fact, give you a financial poke in the eye.

[Luke]

Well I am always willing to build things for people if they are willing to pay. Saabsavior's shifter is obviously a direct copy of Jorgen's. I just want to get rid of the stock housing because I don't use it for the ignition, it sits too low and is generally just a sloppy unit. As it is I have the rear section of shifter box chopped off so (so its stubby now) and a linear bearing added on to the front of the housing instead of the sloppy rubber bushing deal.

[Geoff]

tillfälligt slut does mean 'temporarily sold out'
It looks like they were building some in January though





Maybe we should contact them and see if we can buy a few? I'd take one. I bet with these there is no reverse lockout. They'd probably work with a 4spd or 5spd. Is it me or do these ones look shorter than the ones at the beginning of the thread (the housings look different)

Or if Luke has something devised that will work well I'd buy one from you Luke. But it looks like these guys already have everything sorted out (distances, angles, rotation, etc.)

I talked with Jorgen a bit about a taller shifter. His take was that the box was so sensitive that you don't want a longer lever arm because you'll be exerting more forces onto the box. He was saying with his you get the precision and find the gear every time but you aren't accidentally putting more force through the shifter into the components in the box. I agree with what he says but I still want a tall shifter Plus getting rid of the stock housing would be nice.

[Crazyswede]

Luke and I spoke about several ideas a week ago. he had an interesting idea until I pointed out the little detail that the Saab shifter does everything backwards and opposite of what you are doing to the shifter itself. I think your best bet is to elaborate on the existing Saab setup by making the shift lever longer and changing the pivot point....just like in those shifters pictured above. You are best off by using your own hardware to beef things up and smooth stuff out.

[Rallyho]

I am ready to be the guinea pig for this one Luke!

[Luke]

Yeah I had a great plan drawn up but the only problem is it would require you to relearn a shift pattern that is completely opposite. I have revised the design to retain the stock shift pattern but unfortunatly it does complicate the linkage a little bit.

[Crazyswede]

The unfortunate truth is that the stock Saab shifter setup is quite efficient and simple. Going crazy designing something new will likely be less efficient and more likely to break. So The easiest thing to do is to apply the Stock Saab design to stronger components, a custom mount, and a better shifter height and pivot point.

[Jordan]

Yeah I had a great plan drawn up but the only problem is it would require you to relearn a shift pattern that is completely opposite. I have revised the design to retain the stock shift pattern but unfortunatly it does complicate the linkage a little bit.

Other options:
Turn seat around and move to other side.
Move engine/transmission to rear.

[Luke]

I was thinking of hanging the lever from the ceiling.

[sonett]

The unfortunate truth is that the stock Saab shifter setup is quite efficient and simple. Going crazy designing something new will likely be less efficient and more likely to break. So The easiest thing to do is to apply the Stock Saab design to stronger components, a custom mount, and a better shifter height and pivot point.

I have to agree with Crazyswede, why re-invent the wheel!
I have one of Jorgens shifters on my GL, it works great, it's smooth, precise and strong.
Replacing the rod rubber bush is a good idea, as in Lukes above pictures.

[stig-swoosh]

...yeah I think the ones pictured at the beginning of the thread were made by someone called "Qrille",but he doesn't make them anymore...I haven't contacted him or anything but he posts on STCS ( if this is the correct Qrille) :
http://forum.saabturboclub.com/search.php?search_author=Qrille

I was just curious after seeing them what the deal was,from the look of them,I'd think they work well...it's hard to say w/o actually feeling one,but it seems the functionality would be improved,especially for competition purposes...

...yaknow it looks so simple,but I'm sure the development process would take some time to refine just right...

...put me on the list Luke...when your development of this piece of kit progresses to the final stage,if you decide to fabricate them for folks I'd buy one for sure...